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Post by THE GOB-FATHER on Aug 21, 2005 18:53:37 GMT -5
Well said country!
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Post by Rich on Aug 21, 2005 19:20:11 GMT -5
Ditto.
Rich
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Post by hogdogs on Aug 21, 2005 19:35:08 GMT -5
For hogs or other NUISANCE wildlife I am for baiting and since I am talking hogs... I would GLADLY hand feed an ear of corn fit over the barrel of my shotty! I am removing hogs for landowners so It is the same as for tim... drive around spotlighting and shooting or baitpiles or traps even will run over them if possible! I can run dogs on them or stalk if desired. as far as deer baiting... I don't mind it but I feel that I will never set up a stand or build artificial trails. I don't sit in ground blinds and the only time I am kicked back against a tree is when I stop to drink one of the 3 beers I will take for thirst and since it is nutritious I am carrying a compact lunch in my can, :-*smoke a cig, placing the stinky butt in my pocket to give the deer one more handicap point since they are lower food chain links and I get to use a gun. I never wear camo and I stalk. The challenge comes in finding deer that are in woods that I can silently stalk with the breeze in my favor. In defense of baiting I will assure you that it does take some skill. If you were to 5 tons of corn topped with gobs of buckwild in the middle of my city lot you won't feed any deer ever. So it does matter some. This a bit of how I feel and I will do some debating and won't ever get upset at others disagreement of my views. Brent
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Post by hogdogs on Aug 21, 2005 20:00:55 GMT -5
One more point I failed to mention... I am not after trophy racks (since I can't afford taxidermy). I nave not deer hunted since the eighties. I got my 20 gauge returned to me after it had been stolen then used in a crime 11 years ago. I am going to bag every deer I am legally allowed to offset the feed bills around here. I will feed some to my family (gotta be discreet as the wifa and daughter won't knowinly eat "bambi") but most will be raw feed for the hog dogs. Brent
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texasrack
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Post by texasrack on Aug 21, 2005 20:54:55 GMT -5
I think this is a great topic and many have responded in brilliant fashion. I can see that everyone is very heartfelt in their opinions too.
One thing however, that has not been mentioned is the "areas" you hunt. In Michigan, or Colorado or Montana...there are HUGE free natural resources (sure you have to draw tags, but free meaning a VERY large area to hunt). But being from Texas, I can promise you that there are fewer and fewer "natural" resources to hunt. This being the case, feeders are used on private hunting acres.
Feeders are also used to FEED the deer in my area, not to offer them up a buffet so that someone (well said) can sit their lazy ass in a stand to just pick one off.
A person who TRULY uses the feeder for what I feel it is designed for will NEVER take a deer within 1,000 yards or more of that feeder. I use a feeder, but my use for the feeder is PURELY to add additional nutrients to the West Texas deer population that often times they simply cannot get. I want them fat, big horned and happy...THEN I will HUNT them. Scrapes, trails, funnels, lay downs..I put my homework in on my little 600 acre lease.
Now this year I do have a static stand that is very nice..the main reason for that? We have NO cover in West Texas..you simply CANNOT sneak up on deer where I hunt..the largest thing in my region are medium sized Mesquite trees and if anyone has seen a West Texas Mesquite tree you will know too well my saga I'm detailing here. We have no trees to put a tree stand in..none. The largest trees we have are a few scattered live oaks and you are NOT going to put a stand in an 8 foot to 10 foot live oak.
My feeder is at the bottom and around the corner from my stand. I don't even watch it when I hunt (unless as said there are kids around..then I'll watch without the thought of shooting just so they can see wildlife coming in to eat (mainly Does..and I agree I have NEVER seen a mature 4-5 year old buck at a feeder and I've been hunting this way for a LONG LONG time gang.
My stand is set strategically on a hill top near a "natural" wild wheat field and down from a natural water tank.
I can see two funnels from my stand and all of my deer have been taken completely on the other side of the hill from the feeder either near a watering hole or near the funnel or draw they naturally progress to and from.
Gang I have free hunted in N.C. with my Dad..so I know what spot and stalk is all about. If I could do that in Texas I would do it in a heart beat. It is even very difficult to Turkey hunt in my area, as again there is simply bare minimal coverage to camo in with.
So while I agree with the original poster in that those who take game UNDER food piles is pretty much sad. I think we all need to keep in context what we are speaking of here. There are ways to use a feeder for the BETTERMENT of the heard if they cannot get the nutrients they need naturally to reach their full genetic potential. Sure they have stuff to eat (minimal at best) around my hunting areas..but without supplimental protein anc carbohydrates they will NEVER grow to their potential and never be as healthy as they are when you help nature out.
Good topic
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Post by Phishy on Aug 21, 2005 22:29:53 GMT -5
Man I love this site!!!!!1 ![:D](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/grin.png) I hate baiting, but that doesn't mean that I’m right!! I guess as I look back on the most recent history where I’m hunting, CWD is a big issue with me, I fear the worst, why take the chance. we also have a huge deer population, we also have a baiting issue, seems every body is putting a pile out to pull deer from their neighbors property, some of the worse things have been truck loads of corn dumped, I mean 5 yards of corn, this affects the movements of the deer herd, we don't have a problem with keeping deer alive, but rather a problem keeping too many deer alive through the winter months, it going to happen and when it does the DNR is going to be blamed, like they were for putting the ban in place. Now on the flip side I hate baiting( have I mentioned that ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/wink.png) ), but since it is legal, if it is your choice, do it, but I won't, when I wrote that letter baiting was illegal for a brief time, and there were a lot of people opposing the ban, I will always oppose baiting in my neck of the woods and the letter was my way to support the cause, I lost in the battle but I voiced my opinion, it just seems I was also subdued by a media that sided with the loud but minority of the baiting issue, I feel that vast majority of serious hunters went unnoticed, but hey I might be off my rocker and you can tell me I am, I might not agree with you....but when was the last time you agreed with everyone in the world. As for baiting bear (we don't have hogs but his might apply as well, I never hunted hogs and don't pretend to have any knowledge on the matter, but I assume they are similar to bear, this might as well pertain to some of the states where there whitetail population is not like it is here in WI) the bear population is not a "problem species" that is to say multi million dollars of damage to vehicles and crops. where bears reside and are hunted (from my experience only) is vastly wooded and fewer farms, not to say that they don't do damage but baiting doesn't aid in the winter survival of the species as it does with deer, but bears do need to be managed in some manner, as I have seen property damage to livestock, homes, crops etc, I don't think baiting takes away from the experience of hunting for bear, there's a fine line to draw here, I suppose baiting depends upon the species, their home range and overall population, for me, in WI, the criteria hasn't been exceeded to ban baiting for bear, but it has been for deer. Now feeding bear, you're just asking for problems...
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rjet
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Post by rjet on Aug 22, 2005 10:07:45 GMT -5
Here is a pic of my new deer feeder. Got my stand 15 yards off of it. IF YOU WANT TO KILL BIG DEER, USE A BIG FEEDER!! ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png) ![](http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v354/rjett/deerfeeder.jpg)
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Post by hogdogs on Aug 22, 2005 10:16:24 GMT -5
Not to many "red" silos left!!! I miss them!!! Used to hunt pigeons and rats inside them and rats in the grain "bins" Brent
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texasrack
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Post by texasrack on Aug 22, 2005 13:58:42 GMT -5
Phisy...this is a great site for mutually respective viewpoints isn't it?
Most places if you disagree with someone about something an argument starts.
It is different here..so..with that said..let me disagree...ha!ha!
You make a comment about "serious" hunters and baiting in one sentence (knowing you are not saying those that bait in any sense isn't a serious hunter) but then it was mentioned in here several times that baiting is not sport..you don't track the animal, or scout the animal out.
Well, regardless of if a species is damaging or not, the folks in Texas don't bait because something is damaging. We have two types that use feeders. Some, as mentioned, do it just to pull deer onto their lands and shoot them right under the pen. Others, like myself, use them to suppliment their private hunting lands because their natural resources are limited at best.
But..if someone is going to take a stance on baiting game animals, to me those who stand firm in that stance (and all the grace and respect for them standing up for what they think) should stand firm in that stance for any game animal. If someone is going to take the stance that baiting is not hunting (not saying you did, but it was mentioend in here several times by more than a few), then that mindset should hold true for Deer, Hog and Bear..wouldn't you agree?
I mean, I feel this is one of those heated and debated topics that you cannot be warm on...pretty much a take one side or another side...
What do you think bro?
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Post by hogdogs on Aug 22, 2005 14:18:08 GMT -5
t-rack, I will honestly state, that to me, the land owners I remove for, the landowner Tim removes for and maybe even tim will say that The hogs are NOT GAME ANIMALS, rather they are FERRAL DOMESTIC LIVESTOCK. Once you "go hog hunting" for sport you no longer should feel that I would ever join you at a bait pile. I REALLY DO ENJOY THE "WORK" I DO AND MY SON AND DOGS DO TOO BUT I AM GETTING MORE GRATIFICATION FOR REMOVING ONE THAN BAGGING IT!!! I hope I am not coming across wrong but I have just done one or more of the following for land owners with each hog removed... 1)Removed a property damaging pest, landscaping aint cheap on a residential home. 2)Saved some of the income earning crop or land from destruction. 3)Most importantly... I have removed an animal that poses an IMMEDIATE THREAT TO LIFE AND LIMB of people and pets! I do not ever intend to run hogs through taxidermy (too expensive) and feed most of the meat from hogs i can't sell off to my dogs. It is sporting to put out bait in areas and hunt the surronding areas but If I bloody up 70 pounds of corn by shooting a hog for removal on it, it was worth wasting the rest of the corn to insure a clients happiness in my results to secure that area for future access rights! We recieve no cash for this and to have a place to drop deer during deer season is enough compensation for me! Brent
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texasrack
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Post by texasrack on Aug 22, 2005 14:32:03 GMT -5
Hogdogs, I believe that the wild hog is immune for this discussion. Personally, while I also eat smaller hogs (piglets) and are tasty as heck thrown on the smoker, other than this the animals are a pest and as you mentioned a true threat to human life. So therefore I am not referring to any means of "hog hunting" in my stance on this subject.
Personally I will take a Ferrral hog in any way I can take one....to preserve our private hunting lease and to preserve a life of a future hunter from a 400 lb wild boar (seen quite a few push that around my lease).
So pardner you go and do that job, and I will also thank you for doing it.
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mrjbigfoot
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Post by mrjbigfoot on Aug 22, 2005 14:41:20 GMT -5
Hogdogs, I heard you say something else that's near & dear to my heart & that's about the dogs! I love to see a dog work, doing something it loves to do. To me it doesn't matter if it's hunting birds, rabbits, squirrels, hogs, bears or Mt. lions. Dogs love to do their jobs & to me, it's as much fun watching the dogs as it is hunting. If your really into the dogs, your that much more into helping them finish it at the end! ![:-*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/kiss.png)
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Post by hogdogs on Aug 22, 2005 15:22:44 GMT -5
Cramps from heat and dehydration, hell & high water, Briar thickets from HELL, EVEN A PACK OF DEFENDING HOGS CAN'T Slow me down when it comes to bailing headlong into the MESS!!! I want to come out clean but if we get cut I will hope I am taking as many for them as they are for me!!! No hog will have his way with my dogs if I am present!!! NO SIR NOT GONNA STAND THERE AND WATCH HIM DESTROY THEM!!! But they can still end up crunked up in a hurry I won't allow it and from there may my KARMA and their GUARDIAN ANGELS watch over us all!!! Brent
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Post by hogdogs on Aug 22, 2005 15:26:53 GMT -5
T-rack, Thaks for that. At least I know who is on the same page in the ensuing discussion sure to follow! Brent
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rjet
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Post by rjet on Aug 22, 2005 16:03:34 GMT -5
I didnt see deer dogs mentioned ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png)
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